Noob question from the States - Rugby Forums: Forum for Rugby Enthusiasts & World Cup of Rugby
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Old 08-27-2010, 11:36 PM   #1 (permalink)
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I have recently really gotten into ruby. In standard American fashion, I don't really understand the "league" structure of many sports in other countries.

I'm thoroughly enjoying the Tri-Nations. Right now, I'm watching the ITM cup. My question has to do with the players who play for the nation teams. Take Richie McCaw. Does Canterbury just give him up and play w/o their captain until the Tri-nations is over?

And, I guess a more fundamental question....it ITM Cup the basci Rugby season, like the NFL is 16 games or NBA is 82 games?

I'm new to the sport, so pardon me if these are stupid questions.

Thanks in advance

Bump.
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Old 09-01-2010, 01:34 PM   #2 (permalink)
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any help?
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Old 09-02-2010, 01:52 AM   #3 (permalink)
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Am more familiar with the Union side of things. There you can see McCaw playing for New Zealand's All Blacks (international team) or the Crusaders (Super 14 team). Will try to pass that ? along next time I see someone on here who might know.
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Old 09-29-2010, 08:33 AM   #4 (permalink)
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Wow crap questions, but I'll have a go.
ITM is New Zealands national championship, the best teams square off over the season until he/they who wins the most ends up in a 4 team play off finals series.
Richie will play some games for Canterbury but his schedule is so hectic that he wont play in many if any domestic (ITM) games, maybe a finals!!!

Hope this sheds some light on things a bit.

Oh, by the way the game in Hong Kong or London (whereever its being played) by NZ and Aus. is solely a revenue raising exercise for the Aussies as they are almost backrupt having squandered the fortune they made out of the World Cup on useless Rugby League convicts, opps converts....lol
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Old 10-01-2010, 10:43 PM   #5 (permalink)
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Not sure why they are crap questions. There are no league structures like that in America. The Lakers don't play an entire season without their best player because Kobe Bryant is running around with the national team.

I don't know how the contracts would be structured so that if you are too good, you stop playing with your team.

But, thanks for your response. It does shed some light on it.
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Old 10-01-2010, 11:26 PM   #6 (permalink)
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Think I can see what you are getting at.The New Zealand is quite different from the system in the states but I'll try to explain in a simplified way. The ITM cup is sort of like the NFL Season the play between 13 and 15 games.However it is a lower tier competition sort of like minor league baseball . Super Rugby is the rugby the compares to the NFL the best each team playing at least 13 games last year but increasing this year. The all blacks never play during this competition so Richie McCaw etc are available for all of it. There are no contract clashes as the NZRU runs all the rugby in New Zealand and pays for super rugby contracts and the All Blacks. New Zealand Rugby is all about the all blacks so no one complains if Richie McCaw or Dan Carter aren't available. Hope this answers some of your questions there is a little bit more to it than what I have written though.
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Old 10-02-2010, 12:52 PM   #7 (permalink)
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Oh really sorry, the question is not crap at all, verty sorry about that, It was the lack of responses I was referring too, my apologies. Hope I didnt offend you.

Another thing, Super rugby is not NZ or Sth Africa's dometic comp, but it is Australias, they otherwise dont have one, they really rely on Super rugby to raise revenue etc. Super rugby was an effort by NZ to help Aus rugby from going backrupt way back befor it all started. It has just blossomed from there.
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Old 10-22-2010, 09:25 AM   #8 (permalink)
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Ok, so Super 14 is big leagues (not counting national games). What time of year does that go down?

And before that happens, I guess the NZ team is touring Europe...more or less...for the year end tour? I assume this is nowhere near as big as the Tri-Nations?

And thanks for all the answers.It is really helping.
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Old 08-07-2011, 09:43 AM   #9 (permalink)
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Powercats22 - I'll attempt to give you a complete answer.

Rugby Union in New Zealand is controlled by the national governing body, the NZRU. Every player is contracted to that body if they are a professional player in New Zealand and a member if they are an amateur, which includes men, women and children.

The essential goal of everything in NZ rugby is success for the national side, the All Blacks. This takes priority over anything else.

Any All Black is also a player for his Super-15 franchise (made up of a number of provinces in the same geographic area,) his province (the ITM Cup) and a club in that province. In descending order, each of these entities has priority to that player's services.

So for example:
-Richie McCaw plays club rugby for the Christchurch Rugby Club in Christchurch.
-Christchurch is a city in the province of Canterbury. Richie plays for Canterbury in the ITM Cup.
-Canterbury is one of the provinces that forms the Crusaders franchise. Richie plays for the Crusaders in the Super15.
-Richie resides in New Zealand and plays rugby here, so is illegible for international selection for the All Blacks and other NZ international teams (below.)

In terms of timing, the Super Rugby competition against franchises in South Africa and Australia commences in February and runs through until June.

In June the international season starts, with New Zealand hosting visiting teams from the Northern Hemisphere, Argentina and the Pacific Islands.

in July, the ITM Cup and Heartland Championship inter-provincials commence and run through until October. Concurrently, club rugby also runs through this period for amateurs, women and children.

At the end of July, the Tri-Nations commences, which is the main event. It usually runs through until September.

In November, the All Blacks send a touring party overseas, generally to Europe.

Five wildcards to all this are:

1. The New Zealand Maori (an international team) that plays sporadically and restricts eligibility to players of Maori extraction.

2. NZ Sevens team, who tour the world playing the IRB Sevens competition in the lower-personnel version of the game.

3. New Zealand-A, who are a second-string international side that plays a little bit irregularly against minor rugby nations and in some competitions arranged for similar sides from other top-tier rugby nations.

4. The Rugby World Cup, which leads to the absence of a touring party later in the year.

5. The Barbarians Club (colloquially, "The BaaBaas.") The Barbarians are an international invitation team, one of the great traditions of rugby. They play against international sides and an invitation to play for it is prestigious.

Most All Blacks will play most of their franchise's Super-15 games, every International that they're selected for and the occasional ITM game for their province if they're returning from injury or needing to find form. On very, very rare occasions they'll turn out for their club side, if there are no ITM matches available and they're needing to gain some match fitness.

Generally speaking, selection for NZ-A, NZ-Maori or the Baabaas will ensure that a player is released from Super Rugby franchise duties and below. NZ 7s selection will ensure release from provincial duties and below.

I imagine all of that is a lot to digest. While this structure is different in other countries (NZ and South Africa are the most similar) it's helpful if you think of the game in NZ as a pyramid, with the All Blacks at the apex and five year-olds in bare feet running around on Saturday mornings at the base, with each tier striving to feed excellence into the higher tiers, as this accurately depicts the Kiwi rugby philosophy.

Last edited by oob : 08-07-2011 at 10:21 AM.
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